Ep 13 – Facebook, Friends and Chick-Fil-A

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Welcome to a special edition of C-Webb’s Sunday School.  There really is no rhyme or reason to the order I do the topics for this podcast, I write about what pops into my head or I am inspired by life to write about a certain topic.  I had another topic in mind for episode 13 but it will have to be put on hold because I had a rather interesting run-in with a friend of a friend on Facebook.  I felt that the experience offered the opportunity to demonstrate the types of exchanges one can have with a believer and the mentality of people I set out to challenge.  If you have never had the pleasure of engaging in a conversation with a fundamentalist, this episode will give you a good idea on what it would be like.  Most of my run-ins with Christians are of the liberal type.  Hardworking people living their life without thinking much on what others are doing or even concerning themselves with the activities of people outside of their social circle.  I have no problem with those Christians or any other believer.  They are free to pray to whatever god they choose in the privacy of their home or churches but once those beliefs spill into the public sphere then all bets are off.  So please, enjoy this case study into the mind of a believer.

First some background.  A friend from the military, who knew me as a Christian, posted a picture of his Chick-fil-a box, with the caption “supporting my local Chick-fil-a.”  This was posted on August 1st.  If you are not already aware, Chick-fil-a’s CEO came out against marriage equality and said some bullshit about God’s judgment and blah blah blah, oh and donating millions of dollars of profits to anti-homosexual organizations.  Essentially, if you purchased food from Chick-Fil-a, some of that money went to organizations that are anti-gay.  For me personally, it is their business to do what they want with their profits.  It is a private company but I will not let my money go to such organizations if I can help it, so I will not spend a dime at Chick-Fil-a.  Well, August 1st was the million bigot march or also known as Chick-fil-a appreciation day.  It should tell you something about the cause from the people supporting it such as Mike Huckabee, Rick Santorum and Sarah Palin.  Frustrated, I commented on my friend post and stated the following (this dialogue is between my friend and me):

ME:  Glad you can use your faith to cover you bigotry…would you make your daughter marry her rapist? God says so. Do you wear poly cotton blends? You need to be stoned. Do you work on the Sabbath? All in your precious” holy” book!

  • Then I posted links to the “Biblical” definition of marriage and how God has a very different standard.  From there, the conversation spiraled out of control and the following is that conversation between me and the friend of my friend.  I will read our words verbatim and then interject some commentary when necessary, so I hope you enjoy this trip inside the mind of a believer.  My dialogue will be my voice unaltered and my opponent will be my voice altered but I think after hearing the content, you’ll be able to tell the difference.

ME: I did not intend to insult and everyone is entitled to ones beliefs. When ones beliefs infringe on the rights of others, I have a problem. You have every right to support whatever cause you chose and you have every right to spend your dollars at whatever establishment you chose, I respect that right. Chick-Fil-A openly condemns homosexuality and financially supports organizations like Focus on the Family.

My point for the post is this: I can find a verse in the Bible to support almost any viewpoint. I can find verses supporting slavery and infanticide and also verses supporting tolerance and taking care of one’s neighbor.  The Bible, to me, is a book of stories, written by men over 2000 years ago (science, history and archeology supports me in this) so to base ones morals on it is ridiculous.

To deny rights to any person based on race, religion and sexual preference is wrong.  To use a “holy” book to deny rights to certain individuals is wrong.  So a bigot is an intolerant person…so I ask you, because I take you for an intelligent man and a man I call friend…do you support equal rights for homosexuals?

A:  I don’t support homosexual marriage. Is that denying the rights based on sexual preference…yes.  Is it bigotry…no, I am taking my stance on what is a pretty important issue. Is it bigotry to deny an adult marriage to a minor, or two close relatives? Might sound silly but to those involved it is not.  I do not have any ill will towards any person -homo or not.  I do have it against their actions, homo or not. I am against polygamy in the same way I am against homosexual marriage; my stance on this is not intended to be bigotry, but a stance. A stance rooted in the Bible, yes a Holy book. As you said, one could take a verse here and there to support tons of views.  However, understanding the Bible as a whole removes the errors from those views.  Scripture has to be kept within the context of which it was written.

  • Let’s pause here because I want to point at something important.  I made the point that you can cherry pick the Bible to pretty much support any viewpoint and then my friend goes on to state that his stance is not bigotry because it is based on the Bible, again, my point was this:  Just because you use the Bible as a justification for your belief, you are still a bigot.  Your faith does not give you a “get out of being a bigot” free card.
  • Also, did you catch the “Scripture has to be kept within the context of which it was written.”  This comes up later but it appears my friend is not taking his own advice.  He is taking a book that was written over 2000 years ago and trying to apply it in the 21st century.  I am putting the Bible in its original context; the laws make sense for Bronze Age sheep herders.  It appears my friend is doing the thing he is accusing me of which is taking the Bible out of context.  I continue:

ME:  Not my words but sums up why its bigotry to campaign against homosexual rights based on religion:

I call you a bigot because you support those terrible things I listed above: legally denying GLBT individual’s equal rights, slandering them publicly, damaging them through terrible psychological programs, and even killing them. You can call me a bigot if I start campaigning that Chick-Fil-A-Holes should not be able to marry, adopt, or serve in the military. You can call me a bigot if I ship my friends off for traumatic psychological boot camps because they dared to eat a chicken sandwich. You can call me a bigot if I compare being Republican to pedophilia, bestiality, or necrophilia.

If my worst offense is disagreeing with you, trying to convince you that you’re wrong, or calling you a name? That’s not bigotry, despite how much your martyr complex wishes it were so.

And one more (I think I made my point):

” You can’t say I love my black friends, but I don’t think they should be allowed to marry white people… without simultaneously being a racist.

It doesn’t matter how big of a smile you put on your face, or how many gay friends you (think you) have, or how often you’ve gone to a gay pride parade.

If you’re voting against marriage equality, you’re a bigot. If you’re denying somebody a right that you possess — for no rational basis whatsoever — I don’t know what else to call you. There’s not a single, credible, non-religious reason to deny equal rights to gay people.”

  • My friend did not respond to my comments via Facebook but we did start an email dialogue.  The following is between a friend and my friend and me.

OP:  Marriage is not about equal rights. It is an institution CREATED by god. NOT man, it is his design and to venture off that design is a problem. Marriage today is not held up as it used to be, but that does not mean we just add to the problem. What needs to be done is to have real traditional marriage to be upheld and restored. If homosexuals want to be married they should know who is the author of marriage and if they do they will know it will never be recognized under heaven. If you are a homosexual leave it at that and don’t force that believe under what is to be a holy and sacred union.

  • My response to this is next and I just wanted to clarify what I am about to do.  I am about to pull numerous verses from the Bible about what it says about sex, women and marriage both from the Old and New Testament.  I am doing this to show him what his God actually says…now watch how the cognitive dissonance takes over.

ME:  And there it is…the poor persecuted believer. You see, my belief in marriage equality doesn’t affect your life at all but your belief effects lives of decent, hardworking people who want to be seen as equals in this society, you are the one pushing your beliefs on other. How does having homosexuals getting married hurt your life? Your belief is between you and your god; don’t force it on other people….

Also, what is your idea of traditional marriage? Paul was against marriage and sex, said it was better to be a virgin and never marry…read the following passages:

Genesis 36:6-10, Exodus 21:4, Genesis 16, Numbers 31:1-18, Deuteronomy 21:11-14, 22:28-29, …polygamy is supported, concubines are supported, a rapist marring his victim is supported…

1 Corinthians 7:1 “Now for the matters you wrote about: it is good for a man not to marry…Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman. 2 Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband.

Matthew 5:18-19: “For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.”

The Biblical Definition of marriage is…

An arranged marriage—Genesis 24:1-4 (and many other passages)

A levirate marriage (If a man died leaving no male heir, his brother was required to marry his widow and produce children)—Deuteronomy 25:5-10

A polygamous marriage—1 Kings 11:3 (and many, many other passages)

Not inter-racial—Deuteronomy 7:14; 1 Corinthians 7:39; 2 Corinthians 6:14

Filled with sexual prohibitions—no intercourse during menstruation (The woman is unclean. Yet another degradation of women.) —The woman cannot withhold sex from her husband; she has to fulfill his desire for sex when he wants it. (And another example of the Bible’s misogyny)

Now divorce and women rights:

Not allowed to be dissolved, i.e. NO DIVORCE—Matthew 5:31-32; Mark 10:2-12; Luke 16:18

Except when the man wanted to because his wife had become ‘displeasing’ to him—Deuteronomy 24:1-4

Between a rapist and his victim—Deuteronomy 22:28-29

An arranged marriage by a slave owner for his slaves—Genesis 24:4

Can be between brother and sister—How else do you explain where Cain’s wife came from!

Intended to produce children—Without children a woman was:

  • Shamed—a barren woman was looked upon as cursed by God

Unable to be saved—1 Timothy 2:15

This is from your book.  Explain those away and tell me, what is traditional marriage? What I see is an evolution of marriage over time and times are a changin.  Again, from your own book, respond to those please…and tell me, what is traditional marriage because I know the answer, it does not exist.

OP: I know what Paul said and where to look, but you are taking it out of context. Please put the whole thing is next time. And second of all I bet you believe in separation of church and state as it is taught now days. So according to that why would government get involved with “Religious” dealings and you so passionate about a religious union? And yes believers are being persecuted for taking a stance on our faith. You are saying if a person wants to marry it does not affect my life, but you can say that about a great many things. But is it right to not do anything for what you believe in? No it is wrong, where do you draw the line on what is to be allowed and what is not?

I also happen to have gays in my family and l love them very much. one of my favorite peeps to be around, and I treat them no different than any of my other family members and I also have friends who are. Treatment is no different than anyone else. And they know my views but they don’t call me a bigot or the poor persecuted believer. They know my stance and I theres, and it’s left at that. No name calling or I have an outdated faith. We treat each other with love and respect, I don’t want anything to happen to them because they are gay. I will be the first to defend them and fight for them. there are issues that I don’t believe in and agree with! Bigot, I think not!!

  • Go ahead and start banging your head against a wall because that was what I was doing when this guy started spewing this non-sense.  Christians like to use the persecuted minority card but how can you be a persecuted minority in a nation where 86% of the population claims to be a Christian?  Then he dives into a slippery slope argument with “where does it end?”  It’s easy, with two consenting adults.  Enough said but that is so hard because these type of believers rely on the threat of punishment to keep people in-line.  They fear God’s punishment if they don’t obey, something I address later on.
  • Then he goes on to contradict himself by saying “We treat each other with love and respect, I don’t want anything to happen to them because they are gay. I will be the first to defend them and fight for them.”  Unless fighting for them means not allowing their love to be recognized by the state or federal government.  It is clear he is trying to show me that he is not a bigot while simultaneously being a bigot.  Cognitive dissonance is a bitch.

ME:  Yes you are…sorry, a spade is a spade…are you even reading my comments? Your reason and logic is flawed. You use your faith as a shield but you are still a bigot.

1) Our nation is a secular nation

2) ban all marriage and keep it in your church

3) states are taking away civil unions

4) You cannot be persecuted if you are a majority

5) Church and state separation protects you more than you think

6) I feel sorry for you gay “friends”, the whole hate the sin love the sinner is condescending

7) study logical fallacies and know how many you are making..appeal to authority, slippery slope, argument from popularity

You are losing the culture war, face it..update your beliefs or fade into history. I read those verses as they were written, what context was I supposed to read it in? You should read it in historical context, the morality of Bronze Age sheep herders do not related to 21st century Americans. Take a Biblical scholarship class instead of Bible study at your church to learn the real story of your book….

OP:  Chris do you personally think it’s okay to cheat on your wife?

  • A poorly worded question and I knew where he was going with this so I had to craft my response carefully (fyi, most of my responses were on my phone while grocery shopping).

ME:  I value the relationship with my wife. I want my family to remain intact and I value the trust I have with my wife, so I remain faithful to her. I would not cheat on her, but that is my value. However, I do not condemn those that do. It is their choice.

OP:  That is very good Chris and I am happy that you do have those values for your family not many do nowadays and I don’t condemn those who do as well. So I believe it is safe to say that you don’t want your children to lie to you, or believe stealing is okay, murder is accepted. Where do those values come from Chris? From our judeo-christian foundations the Ten Commandments. These are the bed rock values for civilization, so according to your statements we should update these things or change as you are saying or be forgotten. God does not say no to things just to say no, he says them for a very good reason. To keep us from harming ourselves, if it hurts us or is not good for us, then he tells us to stay away from certain things. Do you tell your kids no for no reason, no you tell because there is a good reason, to keep them from harm.

  • Sigh. See what he did there?  You tried to set me up because as an atheist, I know it is wrong to murder and steal but then where did those laws come from?  The Ten Commandments.  Check episode one for more information on that topic.
  • I have a good challenge for this guy or any person that thinks the Ten Commandments are the only moral codes we need.  Give your children the list and tell them to study it and then tell them that all they need to know about being a moral person is contained within that list, what do you think will happen?
  • As most scholars suggest, Jesus came to get rid of the laws in Deuteronomy so things like shell fish, eating pork, clothing made of two fabrics, etc…If Jesus said to keep the Commandments, and where in the Ten Commandments does it say anything about homosexuals?  I’ll give you a second to check but I can tell you, it doesn’t say a God Damn thing about homosexuality in the Ten Commandments.
  • Anyone with children knows that we show our children how to behave within our society and culture.  I have a good example.  I was at the airport picking up my mom with my four year old daughter.  She saw a vending machine full of flowers and she asked me “what are those flower for?”  So I explained it to her.  When people don’t see each other for a long time and they really miss them, flowers are a gift to say I love you and miss you and that I was thinking about you.  That is a cultural norm I just taught her.  Is that in the Bible?  No, we do this every day with our children.  We teach them how to live in our society.  If you give a child the Bible and say this is all you need to know to live your life, we’d have so fucked up kids.

ME:  That is a far stretch to say that the Ten Commandments are the basis for our morals and which 10? There is more than one set and they differ. Commandments 1-5 are commandments on how to worship and honoring your mother and father, hardly the basis for our laws. #6, thou shall not murder…unless God commands it, I can give you that one. #7 Adultery, not legally wrong. #8 Not stealing, I’ll give you that one too. #9 False witness, ok, that one too. #10, do not covet. So three out of ten have some semblance of law but hardly foundational.

The Code of Hammurabi, which pre-dates the Ten Commandments is a much more robust code of law than the Ten Commandments and the Ten Commandments borrows heavily from it. Egyptians had a code of law, hardly unique to the Bible…

Humans create morals and laws to manage society. We share this journey on this rock flying through space. We are social creatures and we require social contracts to function and live. We do not receive these from on high, we created them and we adjust them as morals and cultures change.

Do you eat shellfish? Pork? Do you allow your wife to go to church when she is on her period? Do you wear clothing made up of two different materials? Grow tomatoes next to carrots? Kill adulterers? Forcing a victim of rape to marry her rapist? Do you get haircuts and shave? Have your children disobeyed you? Have you stoned them? Do you kill those of different religions or worshiping other Gods? All of these are laws your God gave to be obeyed.

Of course you would not do these things, why? Do you need your Bible to forbid it? No, you live with other people, people who are different, people who do not believe what you believe, to keep the peace, to protect yourself, you obey man’s laws. You cannot quote the 10 commandments and throw out the rest or tell me I am not reading it as a whole or taking it out of context. If God wanted us to follow these laws, why not be clearer? Did God change his mind or did human culture and society evolve and morals shifted and change? Which claims requires the less fanciful assertions? Have you heard of Occam’s razor? Simply put: It is a principle urging one to select from among competing hypotheses that which makes the fewest assumptions. You have to posit a supernatural being that cannot be tested, proved or observed. That is a HUGE assumption. I posit that morals can be traced throughout human society with solid evidence and facts to back my claim. Which makes the fewest assumptions? Mine, therefore it is the correct assumptions.

OP:  So we are digging up the Old Testament. On the day Christ was crucified he said “Behold, I make all things new”. So all the things you listed are now void. Please read the bible in its whole form. For the Ten Commandments it does not say anything about not to kill, but Murder it does, it is forbidden. I have heard about Hammurabi and how there are stories that relate to our bible, that is a whole other issue not enough to cover in here. Just read about the tower of babel and how other civilizations have the same stories. get back with me on that one. The Ten commandments are very clear, laws which by all men can live by without question of is it wrong or right. Marriage is not a right or an equal right, where did marriage come from chris?

and what set of commandments are there and how do they differ, besides moses throwing the originals.

  • Do you see where he says “you can’t use the old testament” but then goes on to say gays can’t get married because it says so in the Old Testament.  Which is it?  Then he wants me to take the Bible as a whole, which I have done.  Also, he is not really refuting my claims.  The he goes on about the Tower of Babel and he doesn’t even know that there are three sets of Ten Commandments (again, check out episode one) and that they are all we need to know, I refer to my previous challenge.

ME:  Dude, you can’t use the Bible to prove the Bible lol. If that was the case, I can use The Odyssey to prove Cyclops and Zeus.

Matthew 5:17

‘Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law of Moses or the Prophets. I have not come to abolish them, but to fulfill them.’

So which is it? Fulfill or abolish. If you can’t see the contradictions, I don’t know what else to say. I’m taking it as a whole and it is wholly contradictory.

Where does marriage come from….mankind. God did not create marriage; it existed before your God. Now, cite me some secular sources like I have. Leave the bubble of the Bible and explore the world.

So what verses in the NT condone homosexuality?  Check out my blog and podcast, I explain it all in details atheistsocialworker.org

OP:  Leviticus does condemn homosexuality, the story of Sodom and Gomorrah is a story for that stance, and if you are talking about a cyclops that did happen in a form way. There was a plant that the Greeks used and pregnant women who used this particular plant can’t remember the name gave a birth to children with a deformity a one eye baby. so you are an atheist, I respect that, but can you tell me where we came from or evolved from please, and I mean about that about the human race of course.  and I will check your blog, and other thing why fight so hard against something that you say does not exist. I always find that fascinating.

  • See what he did?  He told me not to dig up Old Testament quotes then goes on to quote the Old Testament.  What the Fuck?  He still didn’t respond to my question of where in the New Testament does God forbid homosexual marriage.  I state this because he said Jesus made the old new.
  • As far as the Cyclops goes, I am familiar with the herb Greeks gave pregnant women which is called Veratrum album or white hellebore which can cause cyclopia but what does that have to do with God?  I’m not sure.
  • Now he tries to change the subject to evolution.  Bring it!

ME:  So, you said Jesus created a new law? Why quote Leviticus? It’s the old law. Show me where Jesus, your God, condemns homosexuality? You can’t have it both ways.

As far as evolution, we evolved from lower life forms over billions of years. If you are speaking of abiogenesis, science hasn’t solved that yet but there are several hypotheses. Unlike you, it’s OK to say “I don’t know” in science. What we do know, we didn’t come from two humans 6000 years ago. Biology and DNA has shown this. Regardless, this doesn’t prove your god.  I’m fighting your discrimination against homosexuals. I don’t care what god you worship but once you force those beliefs on others, we have problems.

You said ” So we are digging up the Old Testament. On the day Christ was crucified he said “Behold, I make all things new”. So all the things you listed are now void. Please read the bible in its whole form.”

Then you quote me the OT…hmmm…and then you said

“Leviticus does condemn homosexuality, the story of Sodom and Gomorrah is a story for that stance.”

Again, quote me Jesus.

  • So I throw it back at him with his own quotes and also try to explain to him how evolution works in a way he would understand.  If you want a more in-depth look on evolution and Adam and Eve, check out episode ten of this podcast.

OP:  Jesus Christ did not come to do away with the ten commandments, eating shell fish, staying away from women who are on their period things of that nature are done away with. And I asked you why are you so mad and fight so passionately against something you don’t believe in. most people who don’t believe in something leave it alone. I believe the reason why you fight so hard against the gospel is because you are afraid deep down that he does exist and you don’t want to answer to him, and want to live the life you want without answering to a higher power, and that thought is a scary thought.

  • Mental gymnastics must be exhausting.  Jesus kept some things but not others?  So confusing, you would think the creator of the universe would be clearer?
  • Then he does an old apologist trick. I willfully don’t believe because deep down I know it to be true because I want to live my life my way with answering to anyone.  Fear is the name of this game and this poor bastard fears his God so much that he would rather obey blindly then think for himself.

ME:  Yep your right, I want to live my immoral, sinful life. How can I be afraid of something that doesn’t exist?

Do you need a book and a God to keep you from doing bad things? Then by all means keep believing but I don’t need that.

How are you so confident you’re right? What proof do you have? Why is your worldview more valid than a Muslim?

I’m growing tired of your arguments. They’re superficial, like your “holy” book.

OP:  What life forms do we come from please tell me and where did they come from, I would like to know what you have found out. And so to put faith into something that is not understood ” I don’t know” and science is ever changing. That is your right to put your faith into something, but a I don’t know answer is frightening. But please answer why fight against something you don’t believe in.

  • You can tell he has a fundamental misunderstanding of science.  Science says “I don’t know” all the time but the difference is, science never stops looking or questioning.  I think he is making an assertion that believing in evolution is the same thing as having faith in God and then claim evolution in not understood.  Only someone who never took the time to understand evolution would say this.  Evolution is clearly understood by scientist.

ME:  Dude, I’m not going to go into details on evolution. Go to Talk Origins, it’ll answer your questions.

Saying God did it, is a cop out. The little device you use to type these messages, science. Vaccines, medicine, airplanes, cars, AC, electricity…all science. What has your god done besides spread hate and segregation?

I already answered your questions why I challenge your worldview; you clearly are not reading my responses. Typical Christian apologist.

OP:  okay that is fine I feel the same here, but if a person shows no respect for a fellow friend or his belief then like you said we are going to have problems. I wish you the best in life and have happiness in it.

ME:  So I am to respect hate? You have to earn respect, it’s not freely given.

If your faith preaches hate, I don’t respect that. If you fail to critically think, I don’t respect that. If you willingly suppress people because of an ancient Bronze Age book, why should I respect that?

Engage your mind, examine the evidence critically, seek the truth, and get out of your comfort zone…know your way is not the only one.

Again, I have no problem with you praying to whatever god you choose but once you force your beliefs on others and suppress others with your beliefs, I’ll fight

  • Let me quote this meme on the topic of respecting beliefs:
    • No, I do not respect your religious beliefs
    • I respect your right to HAVE them
    • I respect your right to PEACEFULLY EXPRESS them
    • I respect YOU as long as you respect ME
    • I do NOT respect your “right” to tell me I am an “EVIL” person
    • I do NOT respect your “right” to tell me I am going to “HELL”
    • I do not respect IGNORANCE
    • I do not respect BRAINWASHING
    • I do not respect CULTS
    • I do not respect HATRED, BIGORTY, SEXISM or TYRANNY
    • I do not respect your RELIGION and I don’t have to

OP:  thought you were done my good man, God gave his only son to die for our sins, meaning we broke his law, and someone must pay for their crime, so Christ paid that price in full for all humanity. We came from an organism and we evolved from that over millions of yrs. those organisms became a fish; the fish grasp some air then grew legs, then somehow through all of that bam!! Here we are the human race, is that basically right? Please tell me.

ME:  Blah blah Christ died for sins. So god created a problem then solved the problem by sacrificing himself to himself but it wasn’t all him only part of him then sent his ghost to inhabit his believers…makes perfect sense to me.

Go study a book on evolution or go to talk origins and then come talk to me. But saying God did it is easier on the ol’ cognitive dissonance.

OP:  Chris you are getting angry no need for that. I have not disrespected you at all. I am not forces my faith upon others, if you don’t believe in Jesus that is your personnel choice and I respect that. I would never force my beliefs on another, but when someone wants something that god did not intend for it then i will fight. Call me a bigot, call me outdated, but there are some things that should never be messed with, you have to draw the line somewhere, and many Christians like myself will not be silent. We don’t wish any ill will to homosexuals or non-believers; we want the best for them

  • FUUUUUCK!! Are you fucking kidding me?  He tries to play mister cool guy by saying “look at this angry atheist” but I am not angry, frustrated, yes but angry no.  Then he says that some things should not be messed with, if he feels so strongly, then why not follow the Biblical definition of marriage that I pointed out early?  Then he says he wants what is best for homosexuals and non-believers which by best I assume means, he wants them to believe like he believes.

ME:  Except the same rights you have….I’m done, you’re hopeless

OP:  but please answer my question about evolution and keep it civil, if you disagree with me and my god that’s fine, but civility.  Have a good night then Chris, I pray you’re not hopeless.

ME:  Dude, I have been civil and I told you, Google Talk Origins, then come talk to me

OP:  Chris answer my questions about the organism and fish then us please, am I basically right or not.

ME: No, you’re wrong. Way wrong…here’s the link if you are having issues finding it: http://www.talkorigins.org/


OP:  Take care Chris


Thus ends that mind numbing conversation but I felt it important that I write about it.  This is the crap we have to deal with.  People like this clearly have a deficit in critical thinking and are spoon fed rhetoric without bothering to understand its meaning.  I hesitate to call this a debate because one person is clearly unarmed.  He contradicts himself with every statement he makes and clearly, he has a superficial understanding of his Holy Book.  So why waste my time?  I like to think that even if you won’t change a person’s mind, maybe you can plant a seed of doubt that will cause that person to think a little about their beliefs but, some cases are hopeless, like this one.  It was both fun and frustrating at the same time.  This guy was a friend of a friend so I have no connection to him but my friend and I have an email discussion going back on forth about this topic that I may one day share.

If you have had similar encounters, I am eager to hear them.  Email me at cwebb619@gmail.com or click on the Contact page at atheistsocialworker.org.  Thanks for joining me.

This has been C-Webb’s Sunday School.  Find us at atheistsocialworker.org or at dumbassmedia.info.  We are on iTunes, search C-Webb’s Sunday School and while you are there, leave us a review.  We can be found on stitcher, Zune and most other podcatchers and don’t forget to follow me on twitter @cwebb619.  Join me next time when I take on more religious claims both holy and unholy